The Pradeep Dalvi Chat
'Godse might have finished Gandhi, but not Gandhism'
Pradeep Dalvi, the playwright who has hit the headlines with his now banned play, Mi Nathuram Boltoy, readily agreed to defend his creation on the Rediff Chat. Check out the transcript.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:5 IST)
EVERYONE: Hello everyone, I am here to answer your questions. Ask me, whatever you feel like asking me about Nathuram Godse, the play :)
Naru Shah (Tue Jul 21 1998 8:58 IST)
Dalviji, Can you tell after 50 years of Gandhiji's assassination what inspired you to start the controversy as our country already has many controversies, local as well as international?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:6 IST)
naru shah: I have not started any controversy. If at all you call it a controversy, it happened 50 years back. It was buried for such a long period. I have only unearthed it.
sunil (Tue Jul 21 1998 8:58 IST)
Dalvi, how do you feel after your show was prohibited by the people who really want to favour you? I mean the Maharashtra government?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:9 IST)
Sunil: No government ever favoured my play. Neither Congress nor BJP-SS. So, there is no question of having any feeling about either of the parties. Yes, I feel hurt because I have been deprived of my democratic rights by the very people whom we elected in the Upper Houses and the state government. The sadder part of it is that none of these honourable members have read or seen the play which they themselves have publicly admitted. So what are they objecting to? The title of the play??
Shahezadi (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:3 IST)
Mr Dalvi, given that Godse was nothing more than a murderer, why don't you write another play justifying Prabhakaran?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:14 IST)
Shahezadi: Let me correct you. Prabhakaran is in no way connected with India's past, present or future. I don't know whether we can call him an NRI or NRE. He never was an admirer or follower of Rajiv Gandhi. But Nathuram was a freedom fighter. He was a devotee of Gandhi before Gandhi gave consent to the idea of India's Partition and the part he played in subsequent unpleasant (it is Nathuram's feeling) events that took place, like payment of Rs 55 crores to Pakistan etc.. Nathuram assassinated him only for the good of the nation which he thought. There was not international or political reason behind it. After killing Gandhi, Nathuram surrendered though he had opportunities to escape.
naresh (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:10 IST)
By this play you are spoiling the image of GANDHI, the great leader of India.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:16 IST)
naresh: I don't think so. But you feel so because Naresh, you have neither read the play nor you have seen it. I have vividly depicted Gandhi's contribution to the freedom movement and have mentioned once that had Gandhi not returned to India from South Africa, we would have never attained freedom.
pinto (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:12 IST)
Mr Dalvi, is it right to twist facts and glorify someone in the name of artistic expression? An objective explanation is something else which is no way related to simple vilification.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:18 IST)
pinto: I do agree with you. Its not fair to do so. And, I have not done it.
sunil (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:13 IST)
Dalvi, if the title is the problem, you might have changed it like Why was Gandhi killed? without mentioning Godse's name. I think the common people should know what is in you play. Can you describe it in short?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:20 IST)
Sunil: I was given the same offer by the censor board. But I refused to do so since I don't like backdoor entries. About your other question, the duration of the play is 2.5 hours. How can I describe the play in a few lines? Why don't you request the government to lift the ban?
sadasivan (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:14 IST)
Mr Dalvi, can you peep into the life of our poor Hindu brothers and sisters eking out their feeble life in Pakistan & Bangladesh?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:23 IST)
Sadasivan: Yes, I can imagine. I have read some reports in the press. And also, I have seen some clippings on the small screen. I feel the way the Indian government has accepted their Muslim brothers and sisters in India, the same way the Pakistan government should show a broader attitude. If it is not possible, we are always prepared to welcome our Hindu brothers and sisters who are staying over the border in India.
pinto (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:16 IST)
Unfortunately, these guys never let me see the play. All i know is from what I read when they started playing it in Gujarat. The point is I am not for banning a play/book/film etc. All I want to ask Mr Dalvi is on a tendency to twist facts in the name of artistic expression. You can definitely portray Godse's side of the story, but that does not give you the right to portray the Mahatma as a villain. In a tolerant society though you should always be willing to listen to the other side.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:27 IST)
pinto: I have not portrayed Gandhi as a villain in my play. Nathuram's lips were sealed for 50 years. Statement in the court, Please your honour, Justice Khosla's book Murder of a Mahatma in which Khosla (the honourable magistrate who gave death sentence to Nathuram) has said that the people sitting in the court, if they had been the jury, they would have acquitted Nathuram. These facts, which were buried deep down just to deny history, I felt, that was not sufficient to glorify Gandhi's image. Glorification is the result of truth and I have done it.
pinto (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:20 IST)
Mr Dalvi do you feel that Partition was entirely the Mahatma's baby? Was it also not a result of the rigid stance of other leaders like Nehru etc? Why single out the Mahatma and commit his murder?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:30 IST)
pinto: Mr Gandhi has said if at all there would be a partition it would be over my dead body. Partition took place but Mahatmaji was very much alive. To quote reports printed in the newspapers at that time, Nathuram had requested Gandhi that Indians don't mind having a Muslim PM. But at any cost, Partition should be avoided. But Gandhiji was not ready to have Jinnah as the PM. Pinto, politically when you try to judge the fathership of a baby, there is no DNA test.
Rajivd (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:22 IST)
Are the books written by Nathuram Godse still banned in India??
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:33 IST)
Rajivd: No, the books are available now. One is Gandhi Hatya ani mi, written by Gopal Godse, the other one is Please your honour, written by Nathuram Godse. And the last one is Murder of a Mahatma written by Justice Khosla. There is only one play written by Pradeep Dalvi which is thanks to the central and the state government, it is not available.
PropoGandhi (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:28 IST)
As far as your knowledge, Mr Dalvi, besides being a patriot, in what other ways did Nathuram Godse contribute towards Independence like other Maharashtrian freedom fighters such as Lokmanya Tilak, etc??
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:35 IST)
PropoGandhi: Nathuram was not as great a man as Lokmanya Tilak. So, in no way could he contribute to the freedom movement to the extent of what Lokmanya Tilak could do. But, of course in a way, he took part in the movement which was though little in comparison, but equally significant.
Rude (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:26 IST)
Doesn't it hold true that Gandhi wanted to prevent the partition of India and Pakistan? I think that was the last thing he wanted.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:37 IST)
Rudi: That is what Gandhiji always claimed. But the subsequent events did not substantiate his claims.
sainarasimhan (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:36 IST)
Mr Dalvi: What is your view on the EXTENT of artistic freedom that should be allowed in a democratic country? Would you allow defaming (in the artistic sense -- criticising) of the present leader? Would you allow depiction of religious symbols in, well, non-religious settings (to put it mildly)? Would you allow the Constitution to be ripped apart? Would you allow for the burning up of the national Flag? Where would you draw the line?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:40 IST)
sainarsimhan: Artistic freedom is a very vague term. But I feel that not only an artist but every citizen of India should at least have one 'Hyde Park' where he can express himself freely.
rudi (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:31 IST)
You look like Vaclav Havel; do you share more than the looks with him?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:42 IST)
rudi: I was told that I have got a half brother in that part of the country. Thanks for confirming the news..
amit duggal (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:32 IST)
Mr Dalvi, how come you are replying only to selected questions?? Does that mean you don't have answers to all the questions??
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:43 IST)
Amit Duggal: Now I'll answer your question c'mon let's have it!
sainarasimhan (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:41 IST)
Mr Dalvi: It is the VERY VAGUENESS that causes so many artistes to take advantage of this freedom ... and overstep bounds! My question is where would you draw the line? Do you think, for example, M F Husain SHOULD HAVE BEEN ALLOWED to carry on painting Sita in the manner he chose to?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:47 IST)
sainarasimhan: I feel that religion is a part where no one can tolerate abuse or insult to to God, Jesus, Allah whoever he worships... not even Mr Husain. But political freedom of expression may influence or affect physical things but not inner things like soul or beliefs. What Husain has done is that he has murdered the beliefs of Hindus but what Nathuram did was the assassination of bodily existence of Gandhi. I feel he might have finished Gandhi, but not Gandhism.
rajans (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:47 IST)
Mr dalvi Don't you think protest aginst your drama was politically motivated, like the Ambedkar statue incident last year at Ramabai Nagar? Also, those present Congressman protesting -- are they in the politics of business & as with all politicians nowadays have nothing to do with the nation? Maybe Congressman fear now that they have already ruined the country for the last 50 years & already lost power, they only now have the goodwill of Gandhi, which they are trying to save.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:50 IST)
Rajans: Yes there was political motivation. I feel that basic respect towards Gandhi is losing ground in the minds of the Congress. Gandhi had foresight that is why he urged that after Independence the Congress should be dissolved. That was the first disobedience that the Congressmen showed towards Gandhiji. So that day's Hulla-Gulla was no surprise, it was absolutely natural for the Congressmen to behave.
amit duggal (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:46 IST)
Do you think Nathuram Godse was right in doing what he did by killing Mahatma Gandhi??
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:54 IST)
Amit Duggal: He thought he was right. In the play I have given a platform to his thoughts and his ideology without my comments or opinions. In the same way I have also given such type of a platform to Gandhiji in the same play. I have not taken any sides. For 50 years only one side of the coin was shown to the people of India. I have tried to show the other side to them.
sainarasimhan (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:51 IST)
Mr. Dalvi: To probe a little further, do you think National Flag burning should be allowed as a means of political expression? This is a burning controversy in the USA, as you are doubtlessly aware.
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:57 IST)
Sainarasimhan: National Flag is not just a piece of paper, it is a symbol of a nation's culture, morals, image and personality. If you feel that burning all these virtues of a nation or what a nation stands for amounts to freedom of expression I feel that you are absolutely wrong in even considering the idea.
Abhishek (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:55 IST)
Do you think it was wrong to hang Godse?
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 9:59 IST)
Abhishek: No. It was a very correct thing to hang Mr Godse. One who kills, maybe for justified or unjustified reasons, deserves to be eliminated legally. If Godse would not have been hanged it would have been wrong to say that "Law prevails in India."
PRADEEP DALVI (Tue Jul 21 1998 10:0 IST)
Goodnight everyone. See you sometime hopefully on some other issue, preferably on a hotter issue. Yours, Pradeep Dalvi.
|
